Curse

Age · Sep 19, 2009, 09:05 PM // 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

Thats what I was referring to when I said Rits were better. also in that I was referring to non-elite options. Obviously RC monks are going to defeat Rits.

So yeah, sorry, I was a bit vague

Mend Condition is still better as I have played a Rit.I do hopefully have SS of my Rit that I had to delete as it sat at The blank Grove mission.that is if you don;t beleive me.Vs all the others I would agree.

paranon · Sep 19, 2009, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

I'd say smiting is what needs a serious overhaul.

Apart from the RoJ bug, Smiting has never, and will never, be a serious alternative to necros, eles and mesmers. Tbh, if you wanna deal damage, try another class, thats not what monks are for.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chocobo1

Ugh, more bad players who think Selfless Spirit nerf was the end of the world. Monks did well without it before, and will continue to do well with it now.

Agreed. I personally have never really liked selfless. Played right, a hybrid bar should not have energy problems except in extreme circumstances.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkofStorms

If WoH is the "only" good healing elite... doesn't that mean WoH is way better then every other one... and therefore, overpowered?

No, the problem is not that woh is too good, it is that other elites are too bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagmaRed

For PvE I run a 2 Monk setup. Neither of the 2 are hybrids, one is Heal+Divine Favor, the other is Protection+Divine Favor.

Although this works, in most cases Hybrids are more effective than dedicated heal/prot bars because you can have multiple copies of key skills such as aegis and prot spirit.

Axel Zinfandel · Sep 20, 2009, 12:18 AM // 00:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by paranon

Agreed. I personally have never really liked selfless. Played right, a hybrid bar should not have energy problems except in extreme circumstances.

After a while thinking things over, yeah, Selfless Spirit was only -really- good with boonprot, and since that was a bit OP, I understand the nerf completely.

I still think it stands however that there are changes I'd like to see to healing prayers in general. People will argue that "prot is and has always been better", but there was a time where healing prayers was a lot more widely used then it is now. Even if full healing bars are bar, I'd like to see the other skills be used for -something- other then to just sit there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paranon

No, the problem is not that woh is too good, it is that other elites are too bad.

I'd go further and say that WoH's -functionality- is too good COMPARED to other healing elites, which are too bad.

I mean, It's -exactly- what monks were designed for. It's an ok healing spell above %50 health, but below 50% health, it's amazing. They've tried to "fix" it by toning down the health so that it's less when it's above... but the issue is that the functionality of the skill is exactly what monks are made to do, so why use -any- other spell?

Why was LoD popular back when? Because remedied a slightly different scenario in the exact way was needed. Party wide damage/pressure? no problem! simply party-wide heal. (it was a bit OP in general, but still..)

The problem with the other healing elites is that they don't do that. Healing burst? Crappy target heal compared to WoH, crappy party heal. Healer's Covenant? WoH is more efficient. Healing Hands? Prots are better, recharge is high, non-elite alternatives are better. So on so forth.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

Mend Condition is still better as I have played a Rit.I do hopefully have SS of my Rit that I had to delete as it sat at The blank Grove mission.that is if you don;t beleive me.Vs all the others I would agree.

Mend Condition? I was under the impression most ran Dismiss for the simple reason that you can target yourself. Plus, Rits have Mend Body and Soul, which is an amazing skill when combined with something like Signet of Spirits.

I'm not sure I understood any other sentence of what you said though

im no farmer · Sep 20, 2009, 01:09 AM // 01:09

The thing with "Learn to monk " is that with players v AI is that the AI are programmed unless bugged to scatter from AoEs unlike players where they have the choice of stay or scarper and thats the connumdrum."I like stay here please...but make sure you heal ME"..when that player dies then you get flamed for being crap.
This is the main reason for me using the monk less in PUGS
Would like to see a EoTn PvE only skill where you call out a healer or any other gimmicky monking skill..most of the profs had some loving from EoTN PvE skills so it should fair that the rest of profs get the same loving

maxxfury · Sep 20, 2009, 01:57 AM // 01:57

Oh well, these days i cant actively out heal an ER infoozer, nor can i actively out heavy prots a ER infoozer. Simple math shows this!

The ER infoozer stops things going "boom!" VERY well! all the heavy damage is either mitigated with a ps, or healed back up with an infuse!
All while been able to do with a virtually full blue bar!

Almost makes my monk sad! If there isnt a ER elem around to do this i can happily do it my self on monk ofc! with Woh, Hb+hp or some variant of a prot bar. Which is nice as the Er elem isnt as wide spread as id have expected due to its huge strengths.

Second slot for a monk WITH an ER infoozer in the team is a nice happy place to sit really. You get to run fun things like Ap-monks or smiters!
Perma solo aegis chains, perma seed of life, lots of Soa and clean up utility, jesus beams yada yada. Basically filling in the missing pieces of the back line.*

You end up with party wide healing, party wide block% LOTS of heavy prot, plenty of clean up, and stupid redbar power, all backed up with small (soa ect) prots..

So compared DIRECTLY to the Er, monks are way down the order. Answer? evolve the style you play!

and if there ISNT an ER elem around? you can still do the damn job happily!

Monk now take a back seat to Er's with regards to the "stopping things go boom!" portion of backline. But still excel at pressure control and cleanup.

*i run them anyway even in 2 monk teams

but thats not the point!

paranon · Sep 20, 2009, 10:34 AM // 10:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by im no farmer

The thing with "Learn to monk " is that with players v AI is that the AI are programmed unless bugged to scatter from AoEs unlike players where they have the choice of stay or scarper and thats the connumdrum."I like stay here please...but make sure you heal ME"..when that player dies then you get flamed for being crap.

As a PuG monk, you have to develop a hard shell to being flamed by people who run in/stand in aoe. If they die because of standing in aoe, tell them why they died.

As for PvE-only healing skills, i really don't think they are necessary. If anet wanted to put in some more healing skills for monks, they would just change one of the useless skills in the attribute, not create PvE skills for it.

upier · Sep 20, 2009, 12:32 PM // 12:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zera Fang

-Thinks- No, not always. You can't play Prot in FA on the Kurzick side because the turtles rip all your enchantments, you end up using too much energy to cover your enchants, that it is NOT more effective. That is one place that a full heal bar is better.

Off, but:
I run:
Air of Enchantment
Guardian
Dwayna's Kiss
Patient Spirit
Holy Veil
Vigorous Spirit
Protective Spirit
Shield of Absorption

Unless the Luxon have massive ench removal, the unlimited energy from AoE allows me to bury everything that will save the NPCs deep enough for the turtles to not play a threat. And the amount of enches and potentially hexes means Dwayna massively outheals WoH.

IntrospectivePirate · Sep 20, 2009, 11:59 PM // 23:59

"With a small Patient Spirit Nerf, and a nerf to Selfless Spirit, I now find myself wondering why people play monk at all. The state of monking is as such, and is a petition for things to change."

people play monk to heal in whatever situation they choose. Not just for a particular skill set. Monks still have the benefit of providing fast bursts of healing. Rits on the other hand are cumbersome to some extent but provide longer duration of healing.